TONYA MOSLEY, HOST:
This is FRESH AIR. I'm Tonya Mosley. If you've been watching the Apple TV+ series "Bad Monkey," you've heard some great covers of Tom Petty songs, like this one.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "I WON'T BACK DOWN")
SHARON VAN ETTEN: (Singing) Well, I won't back down. No, I won't back down. You can stand me up at the gates of hell, but I won't back down. No, I'll stand my ground, won't be turned around. And I'll keep this world from dragging me down. Going to stand my ground. And I won't back down. Hey, baby. There ain't no easy way out. Hey.
MOSLEY: That's Sharon Van Etten. Tom Petty led the band the Heartbreakers, whose other hits include "American Girl," "Listen To Her Heart," "Running Down A Dream" and "Breakdown." The band's classic 1982 album, "Long After Dark," was recently reissued. Tom Petty and the Heartbreakers were inducted into the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame the first year they were eligible, in 2002. As a member of the band the Traveling Wilburys, from '88 to '90, Petty performed with several artists he admired, like Bob Dylan, George Harrison and Roy Orbison. Tom Petty died in 2017 at the age of 66. Let's listen to a portion of the interview Terry recorded with him in 2006, when he had released a solo album of songs called "Highway Companion." At the time, he was hosting his own show on the XM Satellite Radio network, and Terry asked him what radio meant to him as a kid.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)
TOM PETTY: Everything. You know, I still see it as this really magical thing, and it was wonderful. I didn't have the money to have a vast record collection. So I learned everything, really, from the radio. And in the - you know, in the mid-'60s, AM radio - pop radio - was just this incredible thing that played all kinds of music. You know, just - you could hear Frank Sinatra right into the Yardbirds, you know, to the Beatles into Dean Martin. It was just - it was this amazing thing.
And I miss it, in a way, because music has become so compartmentalized now. But in those days, it was all right in one spot. And that's - you know, we used to learn - you know, when I was 15 or 16, playing in groups, we used to sit in the car and try to write the lyrics down as the song was playing. And we'd assign each person a verse. You know, I'm going to do the first one, and you go for the second one. And then sometimes, you'd wait an hour for it to come on again, you know, so you could finish it up. But...
TERRY GROSS: What's a song you did that with?
PETTY: I'll tell you, the hardest one was "Get Off Of My Cloud" by the Stones. It had so many words.
GROSS: Oh, and fast, too (laughter), yeah.
PETTY: Oh, and yeah, and it took us a good three hours to get that one written down. But it was that kind of thing. It was a friend, you know? We - and it was something that was there. You didn't really think about it that much. But looking back on it, it was such a musical education.
GROSS: Well, I want to play another track from your new CD, "Highway Companion." And this is a song called "Down South." Is there a story behind the song?
PETTY: Yeah. This was a - I had a - a long time ago, I had done a conceptual record about the South called "Southern Accents." And this one was inspired by a book by a fellow named Warren Zanes - had written this book about the South. And I read it, and I was really impressed by it. And then I started thinking, well, you know, what if I - you know, I haven't been back there in a long, long time. I lived there, you know, 35 years ago and grew up there. But I went - you know, just kind of went back in my mind, and a story started to kind of develop and appear.
And I'm not really sure who that character is, but I'm - I know part of it's me. And I wrote it - God, I wrote it kind of quickly. I wrote it - I wrote the lyrics out first before I did the music, which is unusual for me. And I - then I searched for a long time to find music that created the right tonal kind of thing with the lyric and the - and I - and had to find a melody that went with it. So it took a little while to pull the whole thing together, but it's one that I'm most pleased with from the record.
GROSS: Well, why don't we hear it? This is "Down South" from Tom Petty's new CD, "Highway Companion."
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "DOWN SOUTH")
PETTY: (Singing) Heading back down South, going to see my daddy's mistress, going to buy back her forgiveness, going to pay off every witness. One more time down South - and sell the family headstones and drag a bag of dry bones and make good all my back loans. So if I come to your door, let me sleep on your floor. I'll give you all I have and a little more. Sleep late down South...
GROSS: That's "Down South" from Tom Petty's new CD, "Highway Companion." I want to ask you about a couple of lines in that song. You said you're not quite sure who the character is in it, but the song has, headed back down South, going to see my Daddy's mistress, going to buy back her forgiveness. Did you go back home to see your father's mistresses? Is that part of the character you?
PETTY: (Laughter) My father's had many mistresses. I never made a specific trip to meet them. But my dad was - he was hell on wheels, you know? He was quite a character. And he was one of those people that was - somehow remained likeable, though he was really a cad, you know? But...
(LAUGHTER)
PETTY: But I - you know, I don't really know where the - I guess the line just popped into my head, and it seemed a good way to start it.
GROSS: Something I want to mention about the track that we just heard - you know it has that kind of jangly rhythm guitar...
PETTY: Yeah.
GROSS: ...That you play. How did you start playing in that style?
PETTY: I don't know. It just appeared. I think we were inspired a lot by Roger McGuinn of the Byrds and his 12-string playing. And it was just something that came to me naturally, and I kind of took it from there, and I think we've developed it into our own thing. But I'm sure it comes back, you know, from the Byrds, from - you hear that sound in a lot of early '60s records. And the Beatles used it a lot. Dylan used it. And between myself and Mike Campbell, our guitarist, we've - we just make that sound when we play now. It - I'd - I'm not really as conscious of it as other people are, but it just kind of happens.
GROSS: You grew up in Gainesville, Florida.
PETTY: Yeah.
GROSS: I think there's a branch of the University of Florida in Gainesville, right?
PETTY: It is there, the University of Florida, the whole thing.
GROSS: So were you in a college part of Gainesville, or were you in a different part of town?
PETTY: No, I was in the redneck, hillbilly part.
(LAUGHTER)
PETTY: I wasn't part of the academic circle, but it's an interesting place because you can meet almost any kind of person from many walks of life because of the university. But it's really surrounded by this kind of very rural kind of people that are - you know, they're farmers or, you know, tractor drivers or, you know, just all kind of game wardens. You name it, you know? So it's an interesting blend.
My family wasn't involved in the college, you know? They were more of just your white trash kind of, you know, family. And so I have that kind of background, but I always kind of aspired to be something else. And I made a lot of different friends over the years that were, you know, passing through.
GROSS: What did your parents do for a living?
PETTY: Well, my mother worked in the tax collector's office as a clerk. And my dad had a variety of jobs, you know, from - at one point, he owned the only grocery store in the Black part of town, the only Black grocery store that catered exclusively to Black people. And so I used to go down there when I was quite young, and I was just put out in the back. And so it was unusual to me that I'd play all day with Black kids and then they'd bring me back to our, you know, little suburb that we lived in and it was all white kids, you know? And then from there, he went - he did a whole line of different jobs of being an insurance salesman, a truck driver, all kinds of different things.
GROSS: Now, you had an uncle - I guess this is a famous story in your life, because you got to meet Elvis Presley on a movie set when you were 11 through an uncle of yours who was doing something on the set, though I'm not sure what.
PETTY: Yeah, yeah, I had an uncle by marriage who was the kind of - he was very into film. He was the guy in town that developed all the film, and he had a movie camera. He used to film the college basketball practices and football practices. And when a movie came nearby, as a lot of them did around northern Florida, he would usually hire onto the set and work in some capacity. And he was working on an Elvis Presley movie in 1961, I think. "Follow That Dream," it was called. And I was invited there by my aunt, who drove me down to see Elvis. And I really didn't have much idea of who Elvis was. I was only 11.
But we did indeed go there. And it was quite a circus, you know, a lot of, as you'd expect, you know, mobs in the street. And he was just back from the Army. But I didn't really talk with him. I mean, he just sort of nodded my way, you know? I was introduced by my uncle as, you know, this is my nephew. And my two cousins were with me. And he just - I don't remember what he said really, but I was very impressed by it.
And when I went home, I kind of scoured the neighborhood and came up with some old Elvis records. And I started listening to them, and they really took me over, you know? And these were all '50s records. And I had a friend whose older sister had gone to college and left this beautiful box of 45s of rock 'n' roll, you know, from the '50s. And I loved it, you know? It just spoke to me.
GROSS: So how long did it take after that until you started to play something yourself?
PETTY: Well, the idea had never dawned on me until I saw the Beatles on "The Ed Sullivan Show, " like so many musicians did. When I saw it, you know, I didn't think you could just become a rock 'n' roll singer. I didn't see how it could happen, you know, because you needed to be in a movie and have the music appear on the beach and stuff.
GROSS: (Laughter).
PETTY: So I didn't see how one would get that together, you know? So when I saw the Beatles, it sort of hit me like a lightning bolt to the brain that, oh, I see, you know? You have your friends, and you all learn an instrument, and you're a self-contained unit. This is brilliant, you know? And this looks like a great, great job to me. And apparently it did to lots of people because very quickly after that, there were bands forming, you know, in garages all over town. And I was just one in, you know, thousands of little bands that started then in around '64, '65.
MOSLEY: Tom Petty spoke with Terry Gross in 2006. We'll hear more after a break. This is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF TOM PETTY SONG, "THE GOLDEN ROSE")
MOSLEY: This is FRESH AIR. Let's get back to Terry's 2006 interview with Tom Petty. The new TV series "Bad Monkey" features covers of many of his songs with the Heartbreakers. Recently, their 1982 album "Long After Dark" was reissued.
(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED NPR BROADCAST)
GROSS: Let me play another song that was - it's a great song, and it was a very popular song of yours. Johnny Cash recorded the song late in his life. And the song is "I Won't Back Down," which you recorded in 1989. I know it's hard to talk about writing songs, but is there a story behind this one?
PETTY: I wrote this song with Jeff Lynne. We wrote it in the studio while we were mixing another song. And it came very quickly. And I was actually worried about it. I thought that it was maybe just too direct. You know, I thought, well, there isn't really anything to hide behind here, you know? It's very bold and very blunt. There's not a lot of metaphor or, you know, anywhere to go. And - but I was encouraged by Jeff that, you know, no, it's really good. You should record this and go ahead with it. And it's turned out to be maybe, you know, the one song that's had the most influence on people that approach me on the street or talk to me in a restaurant or wherever I go or mail that I've gotten over the years. It's been really important to a lot of people and their lives. And I'm glad I wrote it, and I'm kind of proud of it these days. And I was very, very proud when Johnny Cash did it.
GROSS: Well, let's hear it. From 1989, this is Tom Petty.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "I WON'T BACK DOWN")
PETTY: (Singing) Well, I won't back down. No, I won't back down. You can stand up me at the gates of hell, but I won't back down. No, I'll stand my ground - won't be turned around. And I'll keep this world from dragging me down - going to stand my ground. And I won't back down. I won't back down. Hey, baby. There ain't no easy way out. Hey. I will stand my ground. And I won't back down. Well, I know what's right. I got just one life. In a world that keeps on...
GROSS: You recorded that song just a couple of years after an arsonist burned down your house. And the house was set on fire while you and your family were in it. Did your instincts kick in like they were supposed to when you realized that your house was on fire and that you and your wife and child had to get out of there?
PETTY: They kick in pretty fast, you know, when your house is on fire. Yeah, they kicked in really fast, and it was a pretty horrific thing to happen. And I did just survive with, you know, the clothes on my back, but I don't know. Maybe, you know, that had something to do with the songs like "I Won't Back Down" and things because I felt really elated that they didn't get me. You know? Like, I kind of just - that was the thought that was going through my head - was, well, you bastard, you didn't get me, you know? I survived.
But it's very hard to even believe that someone wants to kill you, you know? It's a very hard thing to go through. And, you know, when the police and the arson people are telling me that, you know, someone did it, I'm just going, well surely, there's a mistake. You know, there must have been a bad wire or - you know, and, you know, they were absolutely sure there was no mistake. So the interesting thing about that is how many people called and confessed the following day.
GROSS: You're kidding. Really?
PETTY: You know, yeah. They were confessing from all over America. And it was like, you know, people in New Jersey would call and confess. Then I realized just how bonkers people are. You know, It's like, you know there's some people that are really bonkers, and you have to be careful. But, you know, that was - you know, I never really talked about that much because it stunned me so deeply.
And I'm sure it had a great effect on the music I did because I came back with this very positive, happy kind of music that - I didn't want to go into any dark corner or anything like that. I was just so glad to be alive and to have to have escaped something like that. And, you know, it was also really traumatic and terrible. But part of it made me really be extra glad to just be alive.
GROSS: Well, Tom Petty, thank you so much.
PETTY: Thanks for having me. Is it nice to be here.
MOSLEY: Tom Petty spoke to Terry Gross in 2006. He died in 2017. After a short break, we hear from filmmaker, director, writer, and now McArthur fellow Sterlin Harjo. He co-created the popular TV series "Reservation Dogs" about a group of teenagers on an Oklahoma Indian reservation. I'm Tonya Mosley, and this is FRESH AIR.
(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, "DON'T DO ME LIKE THAT")
TOM PETTY AND THE HEARTBREAKERS: (Singing) I was talking with a friend of mine - said a woman had hurt his pride, told him that she loved him so and turned around and let him go. Then he said, you better watch your step, or you're going to get hurt yourself. Someone's going to tell you lies, cut you down to size. Don't do me like that. Don't do me like that. What if I love you, baby? Don't do me like that. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
NPR transcripts are created on a rush deadline by an NPR contractor. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of NPR’s programming is the audio record.
